[quake3] ioq3 is going nowhere

[Diego de Estrada]

I think the problem is that the roadmap hasn't been touched in two years!
I didn't see any progress in stuff that matters, like the replacing of
DirectX backend with SDL, or ipv6 support and merging unix_net.c with
win_net.c
The subject in question is comparately insignificant...

On 8/9/07, monk at rq3.com <monk at rq3.com> wrote:
> > I tried my best. I begged. I trolled. I made an ass of myself and I did
> > send a patch.
> >
> > But when small minded people just want to be able to attach their names
> > to Q3 without any interest of progress that leads further than December
> > 1999 then, i guess, i rather waste my time elsewhere.
>
> Well, for something that's not controlled by committee, you can try
> Evolution Q3 or XreaL.  Oh yeah, this will be another long one.
>
> The thing is, from ioq3's website, the stated purpose of the project is:
>
> "Our permanent goal is to create the open source Quake 3 distribution upon
> which people base their games and projects."
>
> While they are open to other improvements, their eye is towards a solid
> basic foundation that other people can improve.  You had a gripe with the
> value of one cvar.  While I and others may support the motivation and
> sentiment behind your request, that doesn't necessarily mean that it's a
> good idea or that it's an idea that EVERYONE is behind.  I mean, who
> DOESN'T want to make Q3 more popular and easier for new players to
> interact with?  It's like free beer for everyone.
>
> But the problem comes with the consequences.  Some of which were brought
> up.  Some of the core developers are very uncomfortable with the security
> issues that may arise from enabling that by setting by default.  While you
> or I may not agree with that, it's a valid concern for some of the people
> here who have put in many days and weeks of work (like, from a straight
> manhour count).  There is of course going to be some resistence from
> someone who just jumps in and wants things done now now now.  I'm guilty
> of that myself.
>
> You made a code patch.  So, I'm guessing you can code.  If you want to
> contribute something more meaningful to the overall ioq3 project, maybe
> contact Raynor of the Evolution Q3 project.  See if he would be adverse to
> you backporting his improvements from EvQ3 1.1 into ioq3.  Heck, EvQ3
> itself is a fusion of ioq3 and XreaL.  Maybe even contact Treb from XreaL
> and see if he minds, too.  I would bet that they probably don't.  I
> suggest EvQ3 1.1 since it still supports lightmaps and therefore won't
> break the multitude of existing Q3 content like maps.
>
> So if you backport the improvements to ioq3, I doubt the core ioq3 team
> would have any problem with including them as optional patches on the
> website.  And that makes it far easier for anyone using ioq3 as a base to
> incorporate those features into their own projects.
>
> Eventually, with enough testing and tweaking, you could probably start a
> dialog to merge some of those optional patches into the main ioq3 source.
>
> Yes, it's a slower process.  However, it's a less abrasive process.  Had I
> the technical aptitude, this is what I would be doing.  As a mod
> developer, I too would like prettier graphics, more modern model/animation
> support, and agree with the sentiment of making it easier for new players
> to get my content.
>
> There comes a time when you have to decide how much you want something.
> It's easy to send a few emails to people.  It's hard to get your hands
> dirty.  I would be getting my hands dirty had I the skillset.  You seem
> like you have the skillset.  The only problem is you've focused too
> narrowly on one certain issue.  And, honestly, ioq3 is not the only place
> you need to spend time on to get that autodownload issue resolved.  You
> need to talk with various mod developers, UrT, RQ3, Padman, Tremulous,
> etc. to get them to change their ways as well.  id just released Quake 3
> on Steam.  People are buying and downloading that right now.  Do you think
> that, for this re-release, id changed their autodownload cvar?  If not,
> why?  They already updated their package once to resolve a DOSBox
> licensing issue, maybe if you contact id and make a good case, you can get
> them to do that tweak as well.
>
> That's not being facetious, that's being practical.  There are many
> avenues to try before giving up.  Some are more work than others.  People
> are dismissing you as a troll because, well, they haven't seen your
> commitment, really.  If you put in the work, you'll earn the respect.
>
> Just like many real life situations.
>
> I hope at one point this issue is revisted as there are several people on
> the list who have the same sentiment as Dirk in regards to enabling
> autodownloads.  For me, though, it's as simple as making sure it's enabled
> in RQ3.  Trying to regulate that for all of q3-dom is beyond the scope of
> my control.  So while I agree with the sentiment, I realize it's not
> something any one person has direct control over and that a consensus will
> have to be reached.
>
> And, I hope at some point in the future, ioq3 grows to encompass more than
> it is now in terms of graphics and content format support.  But, that's
> neither here nor there... if coders want to crossport or backport the work
> done on other projects, that's phenominal and lets everyone share in the
> fruits of their labor.  If they don't, well, that's their prerogative.
>
> Whatever you decide to do, email other projects, talk to id, backport
> stuff as patches for ioq3, I wish you luck.  Everyone here is doing this
> on their own time (well except that SuSE/Novell guy, but that was cheating
> for a week) and it competes with other projects and RL.  If you can find
> the time to put forth more effort, kudos to ya.  There are other routes
> than giving up.
>
> Monk.
>
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