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I didn't say there was no indication that the Linux client would come
out AT SOME FUTURE POINT. Nobody at Epic was saying when it would come
out, and they still aren't.<br>
<br>
I don't believe Epic should share much, if any, of the blame. You
bought something knowing it didn't have what you wanted in it.<br>
<br>
If you just want the Linux binary to come out, that is one thing. But
saying things like:<br>
<br>
"Same here. I'll never buy a game again from them..."<br>
"I just say : F.....U Midway"<br>
"I guess thats what happens when you suck Microsoft's pee pee."<br>
<br>
Indicate that people on this list are feeling much more than a desire
for the Linux binary. What does Microsoft have to do with this? What
does Midway have to do with it? Why wouldn't you buy another Epic game
if it specifically came out for Linux? It's unreasonable levels of
blame, IMO.<br>
<br>
I want it to come out, too. I'm annoyed that it isn't out, too. I feel
like it should already be out, too. That doesn't change the fact that I
decided to buy the game in it's current state. It's my fault, I take
100% of the blame. I knew what it was going to be like, I knew it was
going to have issues, I knew people were going to stop playing it
online. But I STILL BOUGHT IT. I wouldn't even presume to say that
someone else had ANY control over what I did.<br>
<br>
Brizz<br>
<br>
On 2/6/09 11:45 AM, <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:ceil420@gmail.com">ceil420@gmail.com</a> wrote:
<blockquote
cite="mid:1695252079-1233945838-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-705858504-@bxe202.bisx.prod.on.blackberry"
type="cite">
<pre wrap="">Well I'm tired of you acting as though Linux users that bought the game just did so with no promise of functionality in their platform of choice. They were led to believe they would be able to play the game on Linux at or shortly after release. The blame for the wasted money may be 80% on the players, but Epic themselves also shoulder some of that blame. Especially considering their history of Tux-friendliness; particularly with this line of games. This isn't Blizzard or EA we're talking about, but a company known to support. Linux with past titles, and one that promised playability with the latest as well.
Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry
-----Original Message-----
From: Sir Brizz <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:sir.brizz@gmail.com"><sir.brizz@gmail.com></a>
Date: Fri, 06 Feb 2009 11:38:25
To: <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:ut3@icculus.org"><ut3@icculus.org></a>
Subject: Re: [ut3] Official release date
Fair enough, My response to your message wasn't really intended to
target you. I can completely understand people buying the game with the
expectation that the client would get released, I just wish people on
here would use a little more brain power instead of just slapping the
blame on Epic as if they had no involvement in the decision making
process at all.
Brizz
On 2/6/09 11:32 AM, David L. Willson wrote:
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap="">I didn't personally buy the game, but I understand the motivation of those that did. It's important to show approval for ISV's that are allowing their customers freedom of choice. The best way to show that approval is to buy their stuph. I think it's important to wait until the cross-platform goal is achieved, but I understand the desire to reward Epic's promise or intent. I wanted to, too, but because I've been in software a while, I thought it better to wait and reward achievement.
David L. Willson
Network Engineer
MCT, MCSE, Linux+
tel://720.333.LANS
----- Original Message -----
From: "Sir Brizz"<a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:sir.brizz@gmail.com"><sir.brizz@gmail.com></a>
To: <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:ut3@icculus.org">ut3@icculus.org</a>
Sent: Friday, February 6, 2009 11:26:53 AM GMT -07:00 US/Canada Mountain
Subject: Re: [ut3] Official release date
Well, this post:
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://utforums.epicgames.com/showthread.php?t=584654">http://utforums.epicgames.com/showthread.php?t=584654</a>
Was made 5 days before the game shipped, and indicates that the Linux binary was not ready (something that could have easily been inferred from other forum posts around the same time).
And, I'm sorry if you're trusting, but, frankly, the Linux binary could come out in 5 years and they wouldn't have lied. They never gave a timeline, and if you assumed that it was about to be released, you were fooling yourself into it.
I agree that the binary should be out by now, but I'm not involved in Epic's business so I don't know what is holding it back. Recent posts by Ryan Gordon suggest that the binary is practically (if not completely) done, but it's likely stuck behind the same legal hurdle that it was before. What is Epic meant to do about that?
And it just doesn't change the fact that Epic didn't do anything but give you consolation that a binary would come out at some future point, and based on that you made the decision to buy the game. You still bought the game knowing that what you were buying it for did not exist yet. That was your decision, not Epic's.
Brizz
On 2/6/09 11:20 AM, David L. Willson wrote:
There's that fine line again, Brizz. Epic (your car dealer) didn't say "should be". They said, originally, that it "would be" in the box. Then just before release they said, "OK, it's not going to make it into the box, but it will be released." Not "should be", but "will be". Which led some trusting souls to buy the game on faith, led other, less trusting souls to wait, and then led trusting and non-trusting souls alike, to, at some point, say, "Well, what the ~fuck~, Epic?"
David L. Willson
Network Engineer
MCT, MCSE, Linux+
tel://720.333.LANS
----- Original Message -----
From: <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:ceil420@gmail.com">ceil420@gmail.com</a> To: <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:ut3@icculus.org">ut3@icculus.org</a> Sent: Friday, February 6, 2009 11:16:02 AM GMT -07:00 US/Canada Mountain
Subject: Re: [ut3] Official release date
Except that we originally weren't told 'in the future'. The dealer told us the GPS was included. The dealer lied. At least admit _that_ much.
Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry
From : Sir Brizz
Date : Fri, 06 Feb 2009 11:08:33 -0700
To :<a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:ut3@icculus.org"><ut3@icculus.org></a> Subject : Re: [ut3] Official release date
Yes, Linux is not suitable for games. Actually, Linux is fine for games, games are simply not made for Linux. So if you're a PC gamer, anything but Windows is not a choice (and if you say Wine works great, I'll slap you).
Now, I do have to admit a little guilt in responding here, because I knew all you guys like to bitch and moan anytime someone comes in here that doesn't agree with you, but sorry. The reality of this situation is that you are bitter and want to blame someone other than yourselves. This is really more like if you called up the dealership, asked if the car had GPS, told no but it should be released free at some point in the future, bought the car anyway and then proceeded to complain that the GPS was still not out after a year. You bought the car despite the fact that it was missing the one thing you wanted it for, you're the one to blame in that scenario.
Brizz
On 2/6/09 10:39 AM, [FnG] Lambik wrote:
The person that told 'It has GPS in it' happens to be the salesperson, and then yes you can expect to have GPS in it !
Not sure what kind of point you're trying to make, but seems to me your only business here is to stir thing up,
as you have state to play games on windows only.(Linux not suitable ??)
Pre ordering a game has the risk of getting something that isn't quite what you expect of it, but in this case there has been promised support for linux OS aswell.
Epic has the reputation to support linux on all UT series, which has formed a good basis of trust, which they have broken, and that is why ppl are upset with EPIC.
That is something they have every right to.
Lambik
On Fri, Feb 6, 2009 at 6:29 PM, Sir Brizz< <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:sir.brizz@gmail.com">sir.brizz@gmail.com</a>> wrote:
For what? They didn't market UT3 as having Linux binaries included or available.
The problem here is that Epic never guaranteed anything. I appreciate you wanting brand new boxes or whatever your case may be, however that doesn't change the fact that you bought something that didn't include the sole thing you bought it for. Can you imagine, taking this same thing to a more terrible and surely less appropriate analogy, if you bought a car because someone said it had GPS in it, never test drove it, and realized after purchasing it that it didn't have GPS in it? Would you blame the person who told you or yourself for not looking into it more?
I understand that people wanted and were expecting and (possibly) promised Linux binaries and are upset, but, frankly, you DON'T have anyone to blame but yourself if you paid the money for it already. Did Epic make you spend that money? YOU were encouraged by what they said, YOU made a decision, and YOU spent the money.
Brizz
On 2/6/09 10:14 AM, Luiz Gustavo Angelo wrote:
Epic could be sued by this, couldn't ??
On Fri, Feb 6, 2009 at 3:11 PM, Matthias Bach< <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:marix@marix.org">marix@marix.org</a>> wrote:
Hi!
On Friday 06 February 2009 17:57:02 Sir Brizz wrote:
And for those of you whining about how you bought the game and haven't
played it because there is no Linux client, sorry but maybe you should
have waited to buy it until there actually was the only thing you were
buying it for? That seems like the practical thing to do in any
situation. You are missing the point. When I ordered the game there had been a statement
by Epic that there would be a Linux-Installer on disc, as it had been with
2K4. Later they said it wouldn't be on disk, but available on the day of
release. Therefore, as I kind of like to have nice game boxes that I can show
of, I did not bother to cancel my preorder. The problem is that I trusted Epic
to keep to their promises.
Did you buy Prey the day it came out hoping that Ryan Gordon
would release a Linux binary for it, too? No I didn't, because nobody promised that Prey would be ported. When it
finally was ported this was a pleasent surprise.
If you want to be a thrifty
consumer, then be thrifty. And if you aren't thrifty, don't whine that
you made a mistake and try to blame it on Epic or anyone else. You don't
have anyone to blame but yourselves. Maybe I have, but then it is not for expecting Epic to make a port, but for
trusting Epic to deliver the software I ordered.
Personally, I'm sure a Linux binary will eventually come out for UT3 and
when it does I will probably use it. Maybe it will, after all it's already supposed to be done. The real question
is, will their still body to play against. Will the engine still be something
competitive to base your mods on? By the time it will probably take one could
just as well start writing an own engine ...
Regards,
Matthias
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