[cod] CoD and my struggle with NAT
Boy_One (COD System Admin)
cod at kaleplek.net
Wed Jan 14 12:33:04 EST 2004
Sorry all, but i lost track. Somewhere in the line there was a discussion
about this will be fixed in a new release??? Or am i wrong... Can anybody
answer this???
Regards
Quint
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bryan Kuhn" <bryan at infinityward.com>
To: <cod at icculus.org>
Sent: Saturday, January 10, 2004 20:41
Subject: Re: [cod] CoD and my struggle with NAT
> I don't think there is a limit. Don't mess with net_lanauthorize. You
> can try running developer 1 to see if it is trying to auth your cdkeys
> with the master server.
>
> Saturday, January 10, 2004, 9:34:02 AM, you wrote:
> > i'm having trouble with th CD Key autho, too... here's a [probably noob]
> > question for ya: my friends and I are using a slackware box to host a
> > dedicated server; we all run off the same CD-Key, and from my
understanding,
> > this is supposedly okay for LAN servers, but when one person joins, no
one
> > else can. it gives them the Error: CD Key in use. Please reconnect
later
> > or something like that... am I missing something? I'm using +set
dedicated
> > 1, but i've never heard of this set net_lanauthorize argument. Is that
the
> > solution?
>
> > thx!
> > -Tim
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Boy_One (COD System Admin) [mailto:cod at kaleplek.net]
> > Sent: Saturday, January 10, 2004 12:09 PM
> > To: cod at icculus.org
> > Subject: Re: [cod] CoD and my struggle with NAT
>
>
> > He guys, a little update. After a while i can connect again, but when i
try
> > to connect after that no luck. So i tried how long it will take and it's
> > abot 2 minutes. So i'm happy so far but this is still a little bug, can
this
> > be solved????
>
> > Regards
> > Quint
>
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Boy_One (COD System Admin)" <cod at kaleplek.net>
> > To: <cod at icculus.org>
> > Sent: Saturday, January 10, 2004 15:20
> > Subject: Re: [cod] CoD and my struggle with NAT
>
>
> >> Almost there...
> >>
> >> I did what you say and restarted the server. I got in once and after
that
> > no
> >> luck. So i restarted again and yes i got in once and after that no
luck...
> > I
> >> get the cd-kay autho again.
> >>
> >> Can anybody tell me if the set net_lanauthorize 0 is set back on 1???
> >>
> >> Regards
> >> Quint
> >>
> >>
> >> ----- Original Message -----
> >> From: "Bryan Kuhn" <bryan at infinityward.com>
> >> To: <cod at icculus.org>
> >> Sent: Friday, January 09, 2004 20:01
> >> Subject: Re: [cod] CoD and my struggle with NAT
> >>
> >>
> >> > Don't use developer. I bet it will work once you turn that off, there
> >> > might be a slight delay when you first connect though.
> >> >
> >> > Friday, January 9, 2004, 10:53:34 AM, you wrote:
> >> > > Here are all my settings i run on my server.
> >> >
> >> > > Startup line : /games/cod/cod_lnxded +set logfile 2 +set developer
2
> >> +set
> >> > > dedicated 2 +set netp_ip 62.216.16.89 +ip 62.216.16.89 +set ttycon
0
> >> +exec
> >> > > quint.cfg
> >> >
> >> > > quint.cfg (i know i like to use my own name... LoL)
> >> >
> >> > > // GENERAL SETTINGS
> >> > > // seta sv_mapRotation "gametype tdm map mp_omaha gametype tdm map
> >> evreux
> >> > > gametype tdm map farm2 gametype tdm map fivepoints gametype tdm map
> >> mp_mink
> >> > > gametype tdm map mp_v2 gametype tdm map Neverland gametype tdm map
> >> > > Portvillage gametype tdm map street gametype dm map DM_Fort
gametype
> > tdm
> >> map
> >> > > mp_riveredge gametype tdm map mp_berlin gametype tdm map
mp_pegasusday
> >> > > gametype tdm map mp_tanktown gametype tdm map mp_panzerbunker
gametype
> >> tdm
> >> > > map farm gametype tdm map mp_brecourt gametype tdm mp_pegasusnight
> >> gametype
> >> > > tdm map mp_carentan gametype tdm map mp_chateau gametype tdm map
> >> > > mp_dawnville gametype tdm map mp_depot gametype tdm map mp_harbor
> >> gametype
> >> > > tdm map mp_hurtgen gametype tdm map mp_pavlov gametype tdm map
> >> mp_powcamp
> >> > > gametype tdm map mp_railyard gametype tdm map mp_rocket gametype
tdm
> > map
> >> > > mp_ship "
> >> > > seta sv_mapRotation "gametype tdm map mp_brecourt gametype gametype
> > tdm
> >> map
> >> > > mp_carentan gametype tdm map mp_chateau gametype tdm map
mp_dawnville
> >> > > gametype tdm map mp_depot gametype tdm map mp_harbor gametype tdm
map
> >> > > mp_hurtgen gametype tdm map mp_pavlov gametype tdm map mp_powcamp
> >> gametype
> >> > > tdm map mp_railyard gametype tdm map mp_rocket gametype tdm map
> > mp_ship
> >> "
> >> > > set sv_hostname "---> Little Fun Dutch Linux Server <---"
> >> > > set scr_motd "Welcome to the dutch Hell Hole!"
> >> > > set rconPassword "xxxxxxxxxx"
> >> > > set g_privatepassword "xxxxxxx"
> >> > > set scr_friendlyfire "0"
> >> > > set sv_cheats "0"
> >> > > seta sv_maxclients "12"
> >> > > set sv_maxping "200"
> >> > > set sv_gamespy 1
> >> > > seta sv_gamespy 1
> >> > > seta dedicated 2
> >> > > set dedicated 2
> >> > > set g_allowvote "0"
> >> > > set scr_allow_vote "0"
> >> > > seta sv_privateclients "2"
> >> > > set sv_allowDownload "0"
> >> >
> >> > > // WEAPONS SETTINGS
> >> > > seta scr_allow_bar "1"
> >> > > seta scr_allow_mp40 "1"
> >> > > seta scr_allow_mp44 "1"
> >> > > seta scr_allow_ppsh "1"
> >> > > seta scr_allow_sten "1"
> >> > > seta scr_allow_thompson "1"
> >> > > seta scr_allow_bren "1"
> >> > > seta scr_allow_m1garand "1"
> >> > > seta scr_allow_nagant "1"
> >> > > seta scr_allow_enfield "1"
> >> > > seta scr_allow_kar98k "1"
> >> > > seta scr_allow_m1carbine "1"
> >> > > seta scr_allow_kar98ksniper "1"
> >> > > seta scr_allow_springfield "1"
> >> > > seta scr_allow_fg42 "0"
> >> > > seta scr_allow_panzerfaust "1"
> >> >
> >> > > //pk3 settings and messages en wat prive dingen
> >> >
> >> > > //Kill cam-spectate mod + how-to
> >> >
> >> > > set g_ioteamspec 1 // 1 = Teamonly
> >> spectate 0
> >> > > = spectate all
> >> > > set g_ioteamspec "1" // 1 = Teamonly
> >> spectate 0
> >> > > = spectate all
> >> > > set g_iokillcam 1 // 1 = killcam on
0 =
> >> > > killcam off
> >> > > set g_iokillcam "1" // 1 = killcam
on 0
> > =
> >> > > killcam off
> >> >
> >> > > seta sv_linerd1 "Welcome to ---> Little Fun Dutch Linux Server
<---"
> >> > > seta sv_linerd2 "Server Admin Boy_One and Padjepuf"
> >> > > seta sv_linerd3 "Home of -> SE Easy CLAN <-"
> >> > > seta sv_linerd4 "For any questions please contact us at: Server
Admin
> >> email:
> >> > > cod at kaleplek.net"
> >> > > seta sv_rddelay "10"
> >> >
> >> > > seta sv_master1 "codmaster.activision.com"
> >> > > seta sv_master2 "master0.gamespy.com"
> >> > > seta sv_master3 "master1.gamespy.com"
> >> > > seta sv_master4 "clanservers.net
> >> > > // set net_lanauthorize 0
> >> >
> >> > > // ADVANCED SETTINGS
> >> > > seta net_port "28960"
> >> > > seta scr_forcerespawn "0"
> >> > > seta sv_floodprotect "1"
> >> > > seta developer "2"
> >> > > seta pure "1"
> >> > > seta g_log "qconsole.log"
> >> > > seta scr_drawfriend "0"
> >> > > seta sv_fps "20"
> >> > > set sv_maxrate "2100"
> >> >
> >> > > // GAMETYPE - SPECIFIC SETTINGS
> >> > > seta scr_dm_scorelimit "50"
> >> > > seta scr_dm_timelimit "30"
> >> > > seta scr_tdm_scorelimit "250"
> >> > > seta scr_tdm_timelimit "20"
> >> > > seta scr_sd_scorelimit "10"
> >> > > seta scr_sd_timelimit "0"
> >> > > seta scr_sd_graceperiod "15"
> >> > > seta scr_sd_roundlength "4"
> >> > > seta scr_sd_roundlimit "0"
> >> > > seta scr_bel_alivepointtime "10"
> >> > > seta scr_bel_timelimit "30"
> >> > > seta scr_bel_scorelimit "50"
> >> > > seta scr_re_showcarrier "0"
> >> > > seta scr_re_scorelimit "0"
> >> > > seta scr_re_timelimit "0"
> >> > > seta scr_re_graceperiod "15"
> >> > > seta scr_re_roundlength "4"
> >> > > seta scr_re_roundlimit "0"
> >> >
> >> > > // CUSTOM ENTRY
> >> >
> >> > > seta scr_motd "Welcome to the dutch Hell Hole!"
> >> > > // Please leave the above line in or somehow acknowledge you have
used
> >> this
> >> > > program, thanks.
> >> >
> >> > > // START MAP CYCLE
> >> > > map_rotate
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > > Regards
> >> > > Quint
> >> >
> >> > > ----- Original Message -----
> >> > > From: "Bryan Kuhn" <bryan at infinityward.com>
> >> > > To: <cod at icculus.org>
> >> > > Sent: Friday, January 09, 2004 19:09
> >> > > Subject: Re: [cod] CoD and my struggle with NAT
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > >> Are you running developer 1? I have a hard time getting it to
happen
> >> > >> with developer off.
> >> > >>
> >> > >> Friday, January 9, 2004, 4:08:57 AM, you wrote:
> >> > >> > Yeah..... That's exactly my problem a multihomed network for
public
> >> use,
> >> > >> > and no connection from private network... Thanks for looking at
> >> this...
> >> > >> > I hope it's going to be fixed. If you need a
testserver/testclient
> > or
> >> > > what
> >> > >> > else... Here i am......
> >> > >>
> >> > >> >> Its only multihomed servers with public and private interfaces.
It
> >> even
> >> > >> >> works correctly over a vpn with 2 different private networks.
This
> >> > > isn't
> >> > >> >> that common except for people running small private servers
> >> > >> >> which could just be run as dedicated 1.
> >> > >> >>
> >> > >> >> Friday, January 9, 2004, 12:59:14 AM, you wrote:
> >> > >> >>> Bryan,
> >> > >> >>
> >> > >> >>> we have been posting this issue for a long time. It would be
> > really
> >> > >> >>> great if it got addressed. I am really surprised that this was
> >> never
> >> > >> >>> tested. Very few companies used public IP address for internal
> >> LANs.
> >> > >> >>> All of them use non-public addresses (i.e. 192.168.0.0).
> >> > >> >>
> >> > >> >>> I also think this applies to the Windows version.
> >> > >> >>
> >> > >> >>
> >> > >> >>> Bryan Kuhn said:
> >> > >> >>>> I think I finally reproed this. No promises it gets fixed or
> >> anything
> >> > >> >>>> though.
> >> > >> >>>>
> >> > >> >>>> -----Original Message-----
> >> > >> >>>> From: Eduardo E. Silva [mailto:esilva at silvex.com]
> >> > >> >>>> Sent: Thursday, January 08, 2004 12:01 PM
> >> > >> >>>> To: cod at icculus.org
> >> > >> >>>> Subject: RE: Re[2]: [cod] CoD and my struggle with NAT
> >> > >> >>>>
> >> > >> >>>> Bryan, I have mine set to 0 (zero) and I still cannot log to
my
> >> linux
> >> > >> >>>> server. MOH:AA never had this problem. My setup is similar to
> >> > >> >>>> everybody. Try if are able to see my server with the in-game
> >> browser
> >> > >> >>>> "|NQ|silvex Linux Host" set for search and destroy.
> >> > >> >>>>
> >> > >> >>>> COD NATed
> >> > >> >>>> Client eth1 Server eth0
> >> > >> >>>> 172.16.200.19<-->172.16.200.1<-- COD/Linux -->24.16.199.160
> >> > >> >>>>
> >> > >> >>>>
> >> > >> >>>>
> >> > >> >>>> I am able to connect to ANYBODY but my server. Will you guys
> >> address
> >> > >> >>>> this issue in the 'upcoming' patch. That will be phenomenal!
> > This
> >> > >> >>>> game OWNS MOH:AA
> >> > >> >>>>
> >> > >> >>>> Bryan Kuhn said:
> >> > >> >>>>> It's a cvar, and it makes the server always authorize.
> >> > >> >>>>>
> >> > >> >>>>> -----Original Message-----
> >> > >> >>>>> From: Eduardo E. Silva [mailto:esilva at silvex.com]
> >> > >> >>>>> Sent: Wednesday, January 07, 2004 12:23 PM
> >> > >> >>>>> To: cod at icculus.org
> >> > >> >>>>> Subject: Re: Re[2]: [cod] CoD and my struggle with NAT
> >> > >> >>>>>
> >> > >> >>>>> What does net_lanauthorize do and where is it set ?
> >> > >> >>>>>
> >> > >> >>>>> Bryan Kuhn said:
> >> > >> >>>>>> Your saying on the same subnet it is still authorizing you?
> > You
> >> > >> >>>>>> don't have set to 1 do you? Are you only binding it to the
> >> > >> >>>>>> external ip address?
> >> > >> >>>>>>
> >> > >> >>>>>> Wednesday, January 7, 2004, 8:51:02 AM, you wrote:
> >> > >> >>>>>>> Yep i did but thats my problem, i use my server and
firewall
> >> > >> >>>>>>> tougether.
> >> > >> >>>>>>> See
> >> > >> >>>>>>> attached picture of my network. The thing is that my nat
> > thinks
> >> > >> >>>>>>> its outside
> >> > >> >>>>>>> an rotates me directly trough nat.
> >> > >> >>>>>>
> >> > >> >>>>>>
> >> > >> >>>>>>> Regards
> >> > >> >>>>>>> Quint
> >> > >> >>>>>>
> >> > >> >>>>>>
> >> > >> >>>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
> >> > >> >>>>>>> From: "Steven Hartland" <steven at multiplay.co.uk>
> >> > >> >>>>>>> To: <cod at icculus.org>
> >> > >> >>>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, January 07, 2004 11:40
> >> > >> >>>>>>> Subject: Re: [cod] CoD and my struggle with NAT
> >> > >> >>>>>>
> >> > >> >>>>>>
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> Did you try this:
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> <quote>
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> Had a flash of inspiration this morning I think the
> > following
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> might just
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> work.
> >> > >> >>>>>>>>
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> If we have this picture:
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> NAT box: internal 10.10.10.1, external 1.1.1.1
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> Server: internal 10.10.10.2
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> Client: internal 10.10.10.3
> >> > >> >>>>>>>>
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> If we change this to:
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> NAT box: internal 10.10.10.1, external 1.1.1.1
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> Server: internal 10.10.10.2, fake 1.1.1.2 (alias)
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> Client: internal 10.10.10.3, fake 1.1.1.1 (alias)
> >> > >> >>>>>>>>
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> And then force the client to connect to the server on
> > 1.1.1.2
> >> the
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> ip
> >> > >> >>>>>>> reported
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> in the packet sent to the master will be the ip of the
NAT
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> (1.1.1.1) and
> >> > >> >>>>>>> hence
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> if port forwarding is setup correctly the auth packet
will
> > be
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> forwarded
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> to the client on 10.10.10.3 and it will all just work.
> >> > >> >>>>>>>>
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> Adding the 1.1.1.X aliases to the internal machines wont
> >> affect
> >> > >> >>>>>>> connectivity
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> as they have no routes to the outside world so all
external
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> connectivity
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> will be done via the NAT'ed addresses.
> >> > >> >>>>>>>>
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> I cant test this here as I don't have NAT but Im pretty
> >> confident
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> it will
> >> > >> >>>>>>> work.
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> </quote>
> >> > >> >>>>>>>>
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> Steve / K
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> From: <cod at kaleplek.net>
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> To: <cod at icculus.org>
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, January 07, 2004 12:30 PM
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> Subject: [cod] CoD and my struggle with NAT
> >> > >> >>>>>>>>
> >> > >> >>>>>>>>
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> > Hi all here am back again with more news.... Yes I'm
still
> >> not
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> stopped
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> > debugging... ;-)
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> >
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> > A little update after asking Actvision for some help
and
> > all
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> the
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> good
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> > ideas here (thanks for that) I went to a couple of
friends
> >> of
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> mine
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> who
> >> > >> >>>>>>> are
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> > a lot more Linux/Network goeroes then I am and the have
> >> looked
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> at
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> it
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> and
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> > came with an answer that was a little bit shocking for
me.
> >> The
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> answer
> >> > >> >>>>>>> was
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> > : IT IS NOT POSSIBLE WITHOUT A LITTLE PROGRAMMING HELP
> > FROM
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> ACTIVISION.
> >> > >> >>>>>>> So
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> > now I no for sure I am screwed. ;-)
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> >
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> > The gave a little push in the following direction.
> >> Activision
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> made
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> a
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> > mistake to not make the server NAT/Firewall/Multihome
> > aware
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> this is
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> an
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> > issue that was already on the internet in games like
> > Diablo
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> etc.
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> where
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> > they fixed it (I really don't know how).
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> >
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> > My friends said this method that activision used is a
lot
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> better
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> then
> >> > >> >>>>>>> the
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> > Method of EA because in the actvision method the server
> >> owner
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> doesn't
> >> > >> >>>>>>> get
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> > the cd-keys in and can't steal them (See a post of me a
> >> while
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> back).
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> But
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> > this method also brings some problem (DUHHHHH). A fix
> > would
> >> be
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> that
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> it
> >> > >> >>>>>>> is
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> > possible on the server to config it and say if you use
a
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> NAT/Firewall
> >> > >> >>>>>>> with
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> > a private address like 10.5.x.x/192.168.x.x etc. etc.
to
> >> give
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> you
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> an
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> > opportunity to give an other address in a config file
> >> (public
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> address)
> >> > >> >>>>>>> the
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> > will use to auth by activision. This method is like a
> > proxy
> >> so
> >> > >> >>>>>>> activision
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> > should create a little proxy in there server for nat
etc.
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> >
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> > We all came to the conclusion when the hype is gone the
> > came
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> will
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> die
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> > because the private range users who want to play it
will
> > not
> >> be
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> able
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> to
> >> > >> >>>>>>> do
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> > so.
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> >
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> > So is there a way I can connect to activision or talk
to
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> somebody
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> who
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> > build the linux binary version who can help me with
this
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> problem.
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> Please
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> > Please help my server is going up in the list and is
full
> >> every
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> day
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> now,
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> > and in this way also I have to stop it because I like
to
> >> host
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> if I
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> can
> >> > >> >>>>>>> be
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> > a part of it. ;-)
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> >
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> > So please who can get me in contact with one of those
guys
> >> or
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> are
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> they
> >> > >> >>>>>>> in
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> > this mailing group?????
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> >
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> > Regards
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> > Quint
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> > Boy_One
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> >
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> >
> >> > >> >>>>>>>>
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> ================================================
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> This e.mail is private and confidential between Multiplay
> > (UK)
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> Ltd. and
> >> > >> >>>>>>> the person or entity to whom it is addressed. In the event
of
> >> > >> >>>>>>> misdirection,
> >> > >> >>>>>>> the recipient is prohibited from using, copying, printing
or
> >> > >> >>>>>>> otherwise disseminating it or any information contained in
> > it.
> >> > >> >>>>>>>>
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> In the event of misdirection, illegible or incomplete
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> transmission please
> >> > >> >>>>>>> telephone (023) 8024 3137
> >> > >> >>>>>>>> or return the E.mail to postmaster at multiplay.co.uk.
> >> > >> >>>>>>>>
> >> > >> >>>>>>>>
> >> > >> >>>>>>>>
> >> > >> >>>>>>
> >> > >> >>>>>
> >> > >> >>>>>
> >> > >> >>>>> --
> >> > >> >>>>> Thanks,
> >> > >> >>>>>
> >> > >> >>>>> Ed Silva
> >> > >> >>>>> Silvex Consulting Inc.
> >> > >> >>>>> esilva at silvex.com
> >> > >> >>>>> (714) 504-6870 Cell
> >> > >> >>>>> (714) 897-3800 Fax
> >> > >> >>>>>
> >> > >> >>>>>
> >> > >> >>>>
> >> > >> >>>>
> >> > >> >>>> --
> >> > >> >>>> Thanks,
> >> > >> >>>>
> >> > >> >>>> Ed Silva
> >> > >> >>>> Silvex Consulting Inc.
> >> > >> >>>> esilva at silvex.com
> >> > >> >>>> (714) 504-6870 Cell
> >> > >> >>>> (714) 897-3800 Fax
> >> > >>
> >> > >>
> >> > >>
> >> > >>
> >> > >>
> >> > >>
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >>
> >>
> >>
>
>
>
>
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